|
|
Swaveda - Articles - The Third Way on Conscious Evolution
|
By Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet | May 15, 2005
PART I
The past holds such a fascination for all of us that we are unable to see the same thread of an ancient knowledge weaving its way across the ages into the present. We search for the hidden, the arcane and esoteric, and therefore we often miss the forest for the trees, preferring to concentrate on discovering in our long lost past the answer to who we are, where we came from and where we are going. Atlantis, legendary ...
|
| Comments | robert wilkinson Sep 05, 2004 - 07:40 AM (PT) [ 1 of 9 ]
The famous physicist, Robert Oppenheimer, once wrote, "...there are two ways of thinking; the way of Time and history, and the way of eternity and timelessness. Both are part of man's effort to comprehend the world in which he lives. Neither is comprehended in the other, nor reducible to it, each supplementing the other, neither telling the whole story."
In her article, The Third Way - on conscious evolution, Ms. Norelli-Bachelet gives us the key to INTEGRATE Oppenheimer's two ways of thinking - the Being and Becoming, History and Timelessness, and opens the way to seeing the TOTAL REALITY where meaning and purpose come once again into clear focus. Bravo!!!
Sridharan Srinivasan Sep 05, 2004 - 21:14 PM (PT) [ 2 of 9 ]
A though-provoking article. But one thing that bothers me is that the author seems to imply that the "ancients" had an answer that's been "lost." I think you see the same thread in pretty much every religious movement -- people who lived ages ago were "sons of God," "prophets," and "God talked directly to some of them". I know people who lived before us were smarter than we give them credit for. They might not be able to microwave their food or operate a VCR - but there were people among them who invented writing, numbers and pretty much all ideas that make us "civilized."
My own take is that people who wrote the Vedas, the Upanishads and even the old testament, had pretty strong ideas about God. Some of these were right, and some of them were wrong. We need to pick what's right, discard what's wrong anf chart our own path.
Glenn Smith Sep 16, 2004 - 12:16 PM (PT) [ 3 of 9 ]
Thought provoking but misguided on many accounts.
The "Zero Point" spoken of was never lost but is hidden. The Surya-Siddhanta speaks of Chitra (Alpha-Virginis) as the star on the exact 180 degree point of the sidereal zodiac. There is no significant star listed at the zero degree point for good reason. When the star at the 180 degree point reaches the local meridian at exact midnight then that is the date when the sun is in (enter) Aries (Mesha). You can't see stars in the daylight and therefore a bright star used for measuring the sidereal zodiac shouldn't be expected at the zero point.
The long dissertation about the pyramids, humanity's lost golden age and the earth centered "true" zero point based on the ecliptic are old arguments used by tropical astrologers and new agers to advance their agenda.
Careful research of the Surya-siddhanta can dispel many of these misconceptions and also advance the cause of Vedic knowledge to the modern world.
Patricia Heidt Sep 21, 2004 - 08:10 AM (PT) [ 4 of 9 ]
I just read Voyages of the Pyramid Builders (Tarcher, 2003). Among many points, Dr. Schoch notes that the sides of the Giza pyramid are aligned with the four Cardinal points; but he doesn’t say anything more about this.
In this article, Ms Norelli-Bachelet makes a big deal about this fact; she wonders why the builders would go to such efforts to align these massive stones with the Cardinal points of the earth.
For her, it is one of ‘the clues’ left for us to get the importance of what it means to be born on the third planet from the Sun. (She says the Indian seers left the same clues in the Rig Veda. )The builders of the Giza Pyramid (in the Age of Leo) had a realization of the greatest knowledge of that time and wanted to be sure that when the human race woke up from their deep sleep (in the Age of Aquarius) the message would have withstood the ravages of the ages.
What’s the message?
Ms. Norelli-Bachelet says they knew that the division of the Earth into four parts of 90 degrees each (North--South-East-West ) creates the horoscope of the earth – of the Divine. The planet’s spin on its axis around the sun in its twelve month cycle through the four Cardinal points is a particular phenomenon unknown anywhere else in this Solar System. And the movement through these months, or zodiacal signs, is the journey the earth takes, and we all take, as we move from ignorance to full truth and light. (In the Rig Veda, she adds, the 12 months are conveyed as the ‘doors’ which open or close to us.)
I’ve read other articles by this author, so I know where she is going. But in this piece she seems to be putting it all together in grander style! If that’s possible.
A scientific ‘Theory of Everything’ won’t be possible until we first have a ‘vision of unity’ she postulates; so start with the correct ZERO point, based on the EARTH’S OWN MEASURE of the TROPICAL YEAR.
This brings up a lot of questions: Who is going to answer them?
- In India, there are dozens of Zero points – and all based on the CONSTELLATIONAL (SIDEREAL) Zodiac (out there). Who will take the first step and correct this disunity?
- Where is the Calendar Committee of India?
- Without the correct Zero point, the precession of the Ages is also off – we moved into the Age of Aquarius in l926, the time of the appearance of the 9th Avatar. Buddha was born 2500 years ago, so it’s not him… who?
robert wilkinson Sep 22, 2004 - 06:11 AM (PT) [ 5 of 9 ]
The comments by Kalidas on Ms. Norelli-Bachelet's article, "The Third Way" are illustrative of a serious problem which continues to undermine the practice of Astrology and the pursuit of higher Knowledge in India today. His casual dismissal of her article as misguided is presumptuous in the extreme and betrays an embarrassing lack of realization on his part.
As regards the Ayanamsha or "Zero Point of the Sidereal Zodiac, Kalidas references the Surya-Siddhanta and points to the star Chrita which is said to occupy the exact 180 degree point of the Sidereal Zodiac. He leads us to believe that it is but a simple matter to extrapolate from that point to the true "Ayanamsha."
If this were true, we are obliged to ask, why is there so much controversy among Indian scholars as to the exact position of this point? In India today there are literally dozens of 'Zero Points'.
Indeed, the calculations of the rate of precession by the six mainstream authorities (Lahiri, Krishnamurti, B.V. Raman, Fagan-Bradley & Sri Yukteshwar) disagree with each other by nearly 10 percent!
In light of this controversy and in order to standardize the Ayanamsha value, the Calendar Reform Committee established by the Government of India adopted the initial point of the Zodiac for Hindus as the point in the Ecliptic opposite the star Chitra.
This most important of all measures, the seed from which the entire cosmological unfolding for centuries to come has issued, the root of all civilizational expressions of the Vedic peoples, was not determined by a Yogi, Sage or Seer as it has been over the ages, but by a committee!!! Consensus by committee, as everyone knows, is the result of politics and compromise, not the impeccable precision and knowledge handed down by the Vedic Rishis in matters of this gravity.
One member of the CRC, very much aware of this problem is Dr. K. L. Daftary, who warned its members from the very beginning that by opting for a Nirayana Zodiac and the "Chitrapaksha Ayanamsha" they would only be making the confusion worse. In his dissenting note on Page 260 of the CRC report Daftary states:
"…In continuing to follow the Nirayana (Sidereal) system, the Hindu calendar makers are under the delusion that they are following the path of Dharma. They are actually committing the whole Hindu society to ADHARMA."
Daftary's statement corroborates Ms. Norelli-Bachelet's observation that the practice of ayanamsha correction is a holdover from India's dark age when science interfered in matters of the spirit. Confusion and Adharma have been the predictable result.
As an astrological scholar, Kalidas should know that whenever there is any uncertainty or confusion as to date, time or measure, the prescribed remedy is not more arcane formulas and extrapolation but RECTIFICATION – SEEING the truth of WHAT IS.
An attainment such as this is not possible through the reductive intellect of the pundit. It can only be carried out by a Yogi or Seer of a high order who has realized a vision of unity by which he/she becomes one with the thing observed; and only then can a unified theory emerge out of that consciousness. In this Supramental Gnosis – knowledge is free from doubt, self-evident, and irrefragable – just as it appears in "The Third Way."
Centering and Alignment (the Vedic Skambha) are the Key to this realization and this is done according to the Earth's own measure of the Tropical Year. It is not Sidereal or Constellational but Earth bound, Earth rooted and Earthly meaningful.
From this poise, Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has illustrated time and again in a formidable body of knowledge that "Sayana" the Tropical zodiac is the bedrock of the Vedic way.
The most compelling example of this fact is her recounting of the verses to Vishnu (Trivikrama) in the Rig Veda. In these verses, the Rishi sees Vishnu taking three strides from where he stands (in Scorpio/Eagle) and from there begins to measure the universe, moving as the Precession of the Equinox does, in a clockwise fashion through the fixed cross of the Zodiac. This dispels any doubt that the ancients were unaware of the precessional cycle because those famous three strides can only be understood against the backdrop of Precession. It also fixes the points of Vishnu's incarnation as the Avatar and establishes the basis of his Cosmic Credentials.
In this present Age of Aquarius, we see, now more than ever, an urgent need to reestablish the Sanatana Dharma and re-set the clock of the evolution. This can only be done when pundits like Kalidas find the knowledge and humility to recognize their error and bow to a higher light.
Glenn Smith Sep 30, 2004 - 15:31 PM (PT) [ 6 of 9 ]
Alcyone comments are wrong in so many ways that they serve to compound misguided notions into pure delusion.
Where to start?
First of all the Surya-Siddhanta is not an astrological text. You won't find instructions on how to calculate a birth chart and such. It is an astrological text and as such it is very clear that both the sidereal and tropical zodiacs are used but that the SIDEREAL zodiac is the primary one. Astrologers of all types will disagree about the nature of the "Truth" of their visions and the means by which they arrive at them. This is not restricted to Indian astrologers only.
In western astrology there is at least twenty-seven different HOUSE SYSTEMS in use. Are we to presume that this too is a result of a "Great Sleep" and that P.N. Bachelet and Alcyone will reveal the truth that will lead us out of our dark age? Does the alignment of the pyramids show you any clue on the correct House System to use?
All the ancient Vedic scriptures give the Nakshatra position on the Moon for important dates. The oldest zodiac of India was based on twenty-seven constellations. This is because it takes twenty-seven days for the Moon to complete one full revolution on the heavens in relation to any particular fixed star. Calendars in India are based on the Lunar Calendar. Customs vary widely from region to region throughout the whole of the subcontinent, as do the adjacent forms and practices of astrology.
However, after India obtained its independence in the mid 20th century, the bureaucrats were charged with the daunting task of unifying a standard calendar for civic purposes. In this case, a solor based calendar was suitable with the understanding that for local customs and holidays the older lunar based calendar was not to be superceded but to be coordinated with the civil calendar.
Its funny to see people who have a sincere love and appreciation of Vedic culture bring their ignorant and misguided ideas of "truth" and "enlightenment" to problems they perceive as plaguing vedic purity.
As to the comment -- Kalidas references the Surya-Siddhanta and points to the star Chrita which is said to occupy the exact 180 degree point of the Sidereal Zodiac. He leads us to believe that it is but a simple matter to extrapolate from that point to the true "Ayanamsha."
Yes it is a simple matter to extrapolate the exact degree and anyone can do it armed with fundamental math and a current star chart. I bet even Alcyone could do it if he tried.
If you would like to read more about the Surya-Siddhanta, western conceptions of Vedic science and the Sidereal Zodiac please follow this link:
http://www.glenn.freehomepage.com/writings/Barrier/
As for the comment -- From this poise, Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has illustrated time and again in a formidable body of knowledge that "Sayana" the Tropical zodiac is the bedrock of the Vedic way.
It matters not how much content one amasses in a point of view if that view is in error. If you read the article for the link above you may start to see through the delusions propounded by the "Sayana" school of thought.
Glenn Smith Sep 30, 2004 - 16:10 PM (PT) [ 7 of 9 ]
Third paragraph reading:
It is an astrological text and as such it is very clear that....
Should read:
It is an ASTRONOMICAL text and as such it is very clear that...
Glenn Smith Oct 01, 2004 - 20:41 PM (PT) [ 8 of 9 ]
And furthermore….
Lets see… I am too arrogant and if I become humble then I will see the light and obtain realization.
Lets backup and recap the proceedings. Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet says that we are currently in a great sleep and have lost our way. The ancients have left us clues as to where we can regain the true path. The great pyramids of Giza and the Vedas have these clues and they all suggest that among other things that we have lost the Earth centric vision. Indian astrologers and mystics have been misled by losing the true zero point and persist in their ignorant assumptions that the starry background of the zodiac contains the zero point. The legends such as Trivikram reveal the secrets of the zero point if we could only understand the esoteric meaning behind the symbology. True enlightenment can be achieved if only yada yada yada blah blah blah……
Who is being arrogant here? Does Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet and her acolyte Alcyone really believe that recent sages and seers such as Paramahansa Shree Ramakrishna, Swami Vivekananda, Krishnamurti and even Mahatma Gandhi have failed to see the cause of mankind’s darkness? Why haven’t they said anything about the pyramids and the zero point and the earth centric solution and so forth. Are they also ignorant and in need of a new sage and seer to set us right?
Guru, Sadhu and Shastra (Teacher, saintly exemplars and the scriptures) are the guiding principle that keep Sanatana Dharma from drifting into endless speculation and wrong conclusions that have plagued the western (Christian) traditions so badly. I have just suggested that the Sadhus listed above were silent about this. Why is this so? What can be the reason for their silence? I have studied many of the scriptures, Mahabharata, Upanishads, Vedanta-Sutra, Bhagavad-Gita, Tantras, Puranas and Agamas, some in the original Sanskrit, and have not found any evidence suggesting that the dark age upon us can be rectified by an earth-centric re-adjustment of our consciousness. Are the scriptures insufficient in their knowledge? They don’t even mention an age of Aquarius! How strange!!!
My Guru has explained to me that we are currently in the Age of Kali which started shortly after Lord Krishna left the planet 3000 years BC. The Age of Kali is characterized by quarrel, confusion, darkness and greed. And that it will last for another 432,000 years in which things will get progressively worse. He never told me about missing zero point and how we can regain our lost way by following the alignment of the great pyramids. And that the twelfth canto of the Shrimad Bhagavatam explains the evils of this age and how to overcome it. No mention of the earth-centric redemption theory (ECRT) there.
Who is being arrogant here? Practicing Sanatana Dharma is more than just speaking new-age hippy code-talk. It requires a strict commitment to and honoring the traditional path of Sampradaya (disciplic succession of teachers).
Maybe Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet can perform miracles. Many saints and sages of India have attained Yogic-Siddhis (Mystic powers) and have attracted followers by displaying miraculous feats. But such Yogis usually defer to the Siddhanta (established conclusions) of Guru, Sadhu and Shastra.
Speaking of Dharma…
adharmam dharmam iti ya, manyate tamasavrta
sarvarthan viparitams ca, buddhih sa partha tamasi
That understanding which considers irreligion to be religion and religion to be irreligion, under the spell of illusion and darkness, and strives always in the wrong direction, O Partha, is in the mode of ignorance.
(Bhagavad-Gita 18.32)
And also this…
sarva-dharman parityaja, mam ekam saranam vraja
aham tvam sarva-papebhyo, moksayisyami ma sucah
Abandon all varieties of religion (Dharma) and just surrender unto Me (Lord Krishna). I shall deliver you from all sinful reaction. Do not fear.
(Bhagavad-Gita 18.66)
Lets see.. Lord Krishna gives us all the assurances that for deliverance we need only submit through Bhakti-yoga and give up all other forms of religiosity. No mention of the pyramids there.
Who’s being arrogant?
It would seem to be more honest that Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet reject her covert agenda of substituting a tropical zodiac upon indian astrologers and just come out and say.. “ Look, I believe that the Tropical zodiac is correct for the following reasons and have western concepts and beliefs to back them up. My practices of Wicca (or whatever) and astrology has granted me certain insights that I would like to share with you. I don’t truly understand why there are so many versions of the sidereal zodiac in use today. Maybe for the same reason that we western astrologers use so many different house systems and asteroids and midpoints etc. But for whatever reason they do that I feel that we can regain our lost spirituality by adopting and earth centric point of view.”
Would that be too difficult? It would be easier than to try a con and subvert the Guru, Sadhu, Shastra tradition. I mean, in order to argue to point successfully she would have to study so many scriptures and learn from so many teachers before she could learn the lingo proper for a good con game. Even then she might not succeed. Its hard to subvert a system continuously vibrant for thousands of years.
The Surya-Siddhanta is an astronomical treatise and discusses the basis for both the sidereal zodiac and the tropical zodiac. For calendrical purposes the primacy goes to the sidereal where dates are given by Nakshatra (Lunar Asterism) and Tithi (Lunar day). For example: from the Shrimad-Bhagavatam we learn that Lord Krishna appeared on earth when the Moon was in the constellation of Rohini (Aldebaran) and the eighth lunar day of the dark fortnight (krishna-ashtami) one hundred and twenty five years before the advent of the Age of Kali (which begun on Feb 18th 3102 BC which comes out to July 12-13th 3127 BC). Incidently, at that time, the Vernal Equinox point was directly above Aldeberan (Rohini). Think about that for awhile. This means that the Sun was near its solstice point. But the scriptures don’t reference this significant date by saying “On the first day of summer, when the moon was at the equinox point…” No it says rather when the moon was in Rohini Nakshatra on the eighth lunar day of the dark fortnight. Clearly a SIDEREAL reference. The PRIMARY reference. From that you can extrapolate the tropical positions by whatever means you want.
This is just a taste of the tradition by which we adhere to reverently. Compared to this can you see how goofy the ECRT earth-centric redemption theory of pyramids sound? What to speak of Vishnu striding upon Scorpio? “Where are the mushrooms? I am becoming one with the object of my meditations and can truly see beyond the outer veil.”
I may be an arrogant pundit but I can recognize a new age sham when I see it and I have seen many.
Patricia Heidt Oct 03, 2004 - 21:51 PM (PT) [ 9 of 9 ]
Take a look at the last page of this article -- the Map of the Ages. Envision Vishnu, the preserver, standing in the Age of Scorpio and beginning his famous 3 steps to measure the Universe, moving through the Age of Leo/lion (some 15 -8600 years ago), on to Taurus/bull (8640 through 2160 year) and then moving to the present time, the Age of Aquarius/man.
The famous lines of the Rig Veda come alive: '...of Vishnu now I declare the mighty works, who has measured out the earthly worlds...' (RVI, 154).
Ms. Norelli-Bachelet says it is the same vision of the cosmos seen by St. John written many years later: the four beasts round the throne -- first the lion, then the calf, followed by man and 'the fourth was like a flying eagle' (REVELATIONS 4, v.6).
I looked up this verse which I have read so many times, but never understood. Yes, it is the same order of the animals/signs... the same cosmic movment obviously. Words written by an initiate, a seer, who is preserving the message of his vision for future initiates to SEE.
And then there is the Sphynx with the body of a lion (LEO) and the head of a man (AQUARIUS) which this author says was built to stand as a cosmic marker, again to preserve the same knowledge (this time in stone).
I've never heard it expressed this way before, but it makes sense to me.
And furthermore I think we should be very careful not to debunk things we do not understand fully. Kalidas, your comments do not offer a sincere critique, rather it comes across as a put down. It seems to me you are playing with sacred things. A hidden agenda?
|
| Add Your Comments | You need to Login or Register in order to submit Comments.
|
|
|
